We love Spitz etc. Great for going down. Not so great for going up. Cost ~1.50

Can we find somewhere to buy the ~100 cones we need to complete our Bivvi collection?

Hilti HKD-S

10mm hole, wedge set by driver that passes through standard M8 thread, as used by CUCC since 1990. Not a problem if hole too deep.

via. Ukcaving forum: HKD-S (Plain steel) - M8 x 30 = 11.65+ VAT /100

Jarv Notes: Thinner walls than spits, only 1 deep ridge vs. 3 on true spit. Seems a bit of a halfway house?

Through Bolts (Aka suicide bolts)

According to Inglethief, standard is: "10mm dia. x 90mm stainless steel through bolts, norm for climbing 8mm dia. x 100mm"

Suicide bolts cheap from hardware manufac:

Q. Can we get normal hangers for these? Commercially available seem to be for 8/10mm bore.

Q. What is the strength of a bolt, wrt. diam and length? Proportional to Diam^2 * length ? Or far far more complex? Energy to drill hole should be proport. diam^2 * length.

Q. Worth getting a 6mm SDS drill bit, or using current 8mm with 'pecker / electric drill?

My feeling is that up-climbing / suicide may as well be mild steel, but stainless is best for any M8x100 etc. used to rig. So should we make it so suicide bolts = 6mm steel, all 8mm are 100mm stainless? Or risk mixing the two types for standardisation of diameter?


  • 8mm x 100mm = 6400 units of strength
  • 10mm x 90mm = 9000


  • M8x50 = 3200
  • M6x40 = 1440
  • M6 (easily) available in 40,45,55,70,85,95
  • M8 in 50,65,80,100,105,120


  • M6x40 Zinc: 7p,
  • M8x50 Zinc: 10p, M8x100 Zinc: 14p
  • M8x100 Stainless: 75p (implies ~identical to the Inglethief price, once included 100% markup for 'outdoor equipment')

Costs scoped from PVRDIRECT web catalogue linked below 30-12-07

Nb: Gladiator's wire was rigged off M18s (depth unspecified), ref. The Hollow Mountain p.94 Zinc/Steel Stainless. Boxes of 50/100.

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